Elves, Armor & Weapons.

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themightyeroc
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Elves, Armor & Weapons.

Post by themightyeroc » Thu Apr 25, 2013 6:25 pm

I have two Elves in my group. One is 3rd level, wears Hide and has a Mithril short sword, a short bow and her spells.

The second is 2nd level and has Leather armor, Longbow and a club plus his spells.

I have been asked how long until they get stuff an "Elf" can use? I'm not sure if I should have them quest for all that Mithril stuff or not? Just wondering how this is working out for others with Elves in your games?

I feel that with the spell casting they are both really well off right now.
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Re: Elves, Armor & Weapons.

Post by Raven_Crowking » Fri Apr 26, 2013 2:27 am

Remember that bronze is a friend to elves.
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Cathbad the Meek (herbalist Wizard 1): AC 9; 4 hp; S 7, A 7, St 10, P 17, I 13, L 8; Neutral; Club, herbs, 50' rope, 50 cp; -1 to melee attack rolls. Hideous scar.

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themightyeroc
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Re: Elves, Armor & Weapons.

Post by themightyeroc » Fri Apr 26, 2013 9:09 am

Raven_Crowking wrote:Remember that bronze is a friend to elves.
I thought no "man-made" metals would work. Or is just STEEL?

What would be the reasoning "In-game" you use for why Bronze is ok? I might steal it from you. :D
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Re: Elves, Armor & Weapons.

Post by beermotor » Fri Apr 26, 2013 9:11 am

Raven_Crowking wrote:Remember that bronze is a friend to elves.
Yup, and so's copper.

If you're following historical progression, copper was used first, then the bronze age alloyed copper with tin to produce bronze, which was vastly superior in terms of hardness. In fact, for a long time, bronze was still superior to iron, because the latter was very brittle. Of course iron eventually got better and then steel supplanted it.

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Re: Elves, Armor & Weapons.

Post by beermotor » Fri Apr 26, 2013 9:11 am

themightyeroc wrote:
Raven_Crowking wrote:Remember that bronze is a friend to elves.
I thought no "man-made" metals would work. Or is just STEEL?

What would be the reasoning "In-game" you use for why Bronze is ok? I might steal it from you. :D

It's iron, which is a component of steel. So, titanium armor (for example) would be okay for elves.

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Re: Elves, Armor & Weapons.

Post by Raven_Crowking » Fri Apr 26, 2013 10:29 am

beermotor wrote:
Raven_Crowking wrote:Remember that bronze is a friend to elves.
Yup, and so's copper.

If you're following historical progression, copper was used first, then the bronze age alloyed copper with tin to produce bronze, which was vastly superior in terms of hardness. In fact, for a long time, bronze was still superior to iron, because the latter was very brittle. Of course iron eventually got better and then steel supplanted it.
You mean tin alloyed to copper.
SoBH pbp:

Cathbad the Meek (herbalist Wizard 1): AC 9; 4 hp; S 7, A 7, St 10, P 17, I 13, L 8; Neutral; Club, herbs, 50' rope, 50 cp; -1 to melee attack rolls. Hideous scar.

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Re: Elves, Armor & Weapons.

Post by cjoepar » Fri Apr 26, 2013 11:56 am

I like to stay with the Appendix N meaning for mithril, so I have gone the bronze route, too. But so that it has some detrimental effect, I work bronze like this:

Any bronze weapon or armor has 3-5 hit points, which I determine and record secretly when a character acquires it. Every time a character rolls a fumble with a bronze weapon, it takes a point of damage, regardless of the specific result on the fumble table. Anytime a monster scores a critical hit on a character wearing bronze armor, it takes a hit point of damage. If a bronze item is reduced to 0 hit points it falls apart on the spot and cannot be repaired. Damaged items with at least one hit point can be repaired by a bronzesmith for half the new cost of the item.

I never thought about copper, but I would probably give it twice the chance to be damaged and 2-4 hit points to represent its inferiority.

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Re: Elves, Armor & Weapons.

Post by Vile » Fri Apr 26, 2013 5:58 pm

beermotor wrote:If you're following historical progression, copper was used first, then the bronze age alloyed copper with tin to produce bronze, which was vastly superior in terms of hardness.
Some of the earliest bronze was copper alloyed with arsenic, which can't have been good for the smiths. I use bronze for elves, the only difference in game terms being its much higher cost (which also makes wearers of a lot of bronze a target).

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Re: Elves, Armor & Weapons.

Post by Stonebreaker » Sun Jun 09, 2013 11:30 am

Early bronze used arsenic, but was eventually replaced with tin.
88% copper and 12% tin.
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Re: Elves, Armor & Weapons.

Post by Skyscraper » Fri Jun 21, 2013 12:25 pm

I think elves should dress in leaves and branches.

Just avoid the kinds that itch.
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Re: Elves, Armor & Weapons.

Post by Clangador » Thu Aug 08, 2013 11:38 am

Skyscraper wrote:I think elves should dress in leaves and branches.

Just avoid the kinds that itch.
And you can keep thinking that. :wink:

Does the DCC rule book define what mithril is anywhere?
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Re: Elves, Armor & Weapons.

Post by themightyeroc » Thu Aug 08, 2013 3:34 pm

[/quote]And you can keep thinking that. :wink:

Does the DCC rule book define what mithril is anywhere?[/quote]



Not that I have seen? Plus that way you can really make it be whatever you want to fit your game. I've already decided that Elves in my game aren't even from the same dimension, so "mithril" is an alien metal.
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Re: Elves, Armor & Weapons.

Post by Tortog » Sun Aug 11, 2013 10:23 pm

Metal? Metal! Humph, Metal is for dwarves. :mrgreen:

The elves in my games use ceramics, or glass etched with runes. By the time they're close enough for enemies to hear the melodic chimes of the eleven armor, it's already too late for the targets. It's also one of the reasons why the elves in my games often dance their way through combat. I figure it is produced by a collaborative effort between elven sages and elven glassblowers.

As far as mithril, everyone has their own recipe... feel free to experiment. 8)
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PS> copper is useless for armor unless alloyed and even then it wasn't used to make anything that represents medium or heavy armor; +3 max AC. Mostly it was used to make studs, rivets, and rings that were mounted onto boiled/ waxed leather. If a player chose to use it I would also inform them that they are at a -2 penalty versus lightning and electricity attacks from the increased conductivity. :twisted:

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Re: Elves, Armor & Weapons.

Post by Weisenwolf » Tue Oct 06, 2015 1:32 am

My Elves use Bronze -1 a/c for armour, -1 die damage for weapons. Bronze costs double the price of iron/steel

This does not include blunt weapons (should an Elf be using one; funnel competence or whatever) and I allow arrows and Javelins to do full damage but I don't allow them to be recovered as the heads only have one good use in them, hit or miss (Can't hamstring the Elven bowman and paying double is enough). Elves can choose when they take up the Mithril offer as described in the rules; most take the weapon immediately (usually a sword) and save up for some good armour. For those spurning Armour I would allow another weapon if preferred.

I'm quite strict on the Iron thing too: wearing Iron armour is an instant -1 die on everything and 1HP per hour and wielding an Iron weapon is -1 action die and -1 damage die and 1HP damage every 6 hours; the penalties do stack. The Elf is WAY better off wearing Bronze.

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Re: Elves, Armor & Weapons.

Post by donfowler » Wed May 04, 2016 11:08 pm

I have also gone through the bronze route. It has some detrimental effect, I use to work with bronze like an armor has 3-5 hit points, which I keep in mind and use when the character acquires it. Most of the time a character rolls a fumble with a bronze weapon, it takes a point of damage, regardless of the specific result on the fumble table. The Website from which I had downloaded the game has given all the information regarding how to play and win the points. You can also try these out for getting help from them.

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Re: Elves, Armor & Weapons.

Post by Tokage » Thu May 05, 2016 12:15 am

Wooden swords.

What? Anyone here played Nethack? All elven weapons were wood, and they were still awesome!

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Re: Elves, Armor & Weapons.

Post by GnomeBoy » Thu May 05, 2016 10:58 am

The first part seems on topic, though vague. But this...
donfowler wrote:...The Website from which I had downloaded the game has given all the information regarding how to play and win the points. You can also try these out for getting help from them.
...sounds incredibly spammy.
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Re: Elves, Armor & Weapons.

Post by BanjoJohn » Wed Aug 24, 2016 4:12 pm

On the subject of Bronze. I would like to weigh in on some game mechanics.

Bronze itself would be just as effective as iron in short term use, unless it comes up against iron armor and weapons which will dent dull and cut through the bronze easier than it would against other iron counterparts.

But bronzes softness makes it much easier to unbend and unbreak than iron, and it doesnt gain any benefit from quenched cooling like iron does, so you can repair your bronze weapons and armor using a camp fire and a hammer. I would say that anyone who uses a bronze weapon or armor is able to maintain the weapon themselves whenever it breaks as long as they spend the time hammering the bronze to harden the edges again after sticking it in the fire to soften it up a little to get it back into shape.

Bronze swords tend to bend instead of snap like iron/steel swords. Iron/steel weapons that break would need to go back to an appropriate forge and be recreated almost as if it was a brand new sword.

So:

Bronze weapons and armor are 1/2 the cost of iron/steel weapons and armor.

Bronze weapons deal the same damage as iron/steel, but if you are using a weapon that relies on sharpness, like a sword or spear, if you fumble an attack your blade bends/warps in a way that gives -1d on attack and damage rolls. Plus every time you use your weapon to attack a target protected by iron/steel armor, there is a cumulative 5% chance your weapon will be dulled through the contact, reducing its damage by -1d.

Bronze armor gives the same AC as iron/steel armor. Every time you are attacked with an iron/steel weapon there is a cumulative 5% chance your armor will be damaged and have its AC reduced by 1 and check penalty increased by 1.

Bronze weapons and armor can be repaired as long as you've got a fire equal to or hotter than a camp fire to heat the metal up, and some kind of hammer to help reshape and reharden the metal.

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Re: Elves, Armor & Weapons.

Post by bighara » Wed Mar 29, 2017 4:31 am

Would rusting attacks affect bronze or mithril? :wink:
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Re: Elves, Armor & Weapons.

Post by BanjoJohn » Wed May 17, 2017 9:08 am

bighara wrote:Would rusting attacks affect bronze or mithril? :wink:
Rust is just the oxidation of the metal. I would take the strength of rusting, and source into account. If it was magical rusting, I'd have it rust everything metal into a dust.

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Re: Elves, Armor & Weapons.

Post by DavetheLost » Thu Feb 15, 2018 8:27 am

beermotor wrote: It's iron, which is a component of steel. So, titanium armor (for example) would be okay for elves.
Just as an interesting FYI titanium can be forged. It takes a hot fire and a strong arm, but it can be done. Much lighter than steel too. Maybe mithril is actually titanium?

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Re: Elves, Armor & Weapons.

Post by Ducaster » Thu Mar 29, 2018 4:02 am

DavetheLost wrote:
beermotor wrote: It's iron, which is a component of steel. So, titanium armor (for example) would be okay for elves.
Just as an interesting FYI titanium can be forged. It takes a hot fire and a strong arm, but it can be done. Much lighter than steel too. Maybe mithril is actually titanium?
Good information: Maybe thats what prof T. Was thinking of when he dreamt it up though lets not forget the classic mithril had many formats and could be made into semi invisible runes and other neato stuff. so probably easier to just let it me a "magic metal"
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