Necromancer: Wizard or Cleric?

Discussion of all things magical for DCC RPG -- "Let the Phlogiston take you where it will..."

Moderators: DJ LaBoss, michaelcurtis, finarvyn, Harley Stroh

Post Reply
User avatar
bitflipr
Wild-Eyed Zealot
Posts: 73
Joined: Tue Apr 17, 2012 11:14 am

Necromancer: Wizard or Cleric?

Post by bitflipr » Wed Jun 27, 2012 8:26 am

I have a player interested in playing a Necromancer type of character. I have a hard time recommending between the Wizard and Cleric.

On one hand, the Cleric receives the Animate Dead spell which seems clear to me to be very necromancer-like.

On the other hand, the Wizard gets a title Necromancer (Chaotic alignment at level 5) and their spell Arcane Affinity seems to point to a Necromancer-like specialization.

It seems that either could be played for that control undead type of experience. I'm curious what others thoughts on this are.

User avatar
Raven_Crowking
Cold-Hearted Immortal
Posts: 2931
Joined: Fri Mar 16, 2012 9:41 am

Re: Necromancer: Wizard or Cleric?

Post by Raven_Crowking » Wed Jun 27, 2012 8:32 am

Either.

But, if you are using a wizard, include a patron that animates the dead with cool Invoke Patron results and patron spells.
SoBH pbp:

Cathbad the Meek (herbalist Wizard 1): AC 9; 4 hp; S 7, A 7, St 10, P 17, I 13, L 8; Neutral; Club, herbs, 50' rope, 50 cp; -1 to melee attack rolls. Hideous scar.

User avatar
GnomeBoy
Tyrant Master (Administrator)
Posts: 3622
Joined: Fri Mar 10, 2006 1:46 pm
FLGS: Bizarro World
Location: Left Coast, USA
Contact:

Re: Necromancer: Wizard or Cleric?

Post by GnomeBoy » Wed Jun 27, 2012 1:41 pm

Raven_Crowking wrote:Either.

But, if you are using a wizard, include a patron that animates the dead with cool Invoke Patron results and patron spells.
Exactly what I was thinking before I got halfway through the OP. 8)
Gnome Boy • DCC playtester @ DDC 35 Feb '11. • Beta DL 2111, 7AM PT, 8 June 11.
Playing RPGs since '77 • Quasi-occasional member of the Legion of 8th-Level Fighters.

Link: Here Be 100+ DCC Monsters

bygrinstow.com

Kuruz, Mendicant, N • AC 8, 4 hp • R-1, F0, W0 • S9 A8 S9 P11 I16 L8
Zend, Grave Digger, L • AC 9, 3 hp • R-1, F0, W1 • S14 A6 S9 P13 I13 L6
Mercer, Outlaw, N • AC 12, 2 hp • R0, F-1, W1 • S7 A9 S6 P13 I8 L13
Dejah, Ropemaker, C • AC 10, 2 hp • R0, F1, W-1 • S8 A12 S15 P7 I11 L7

TheNobleDrake
Cold-Blooded Diabolist
Posts: 525
Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2012 1:36 am

Re: Necromancer: Wizard or Cleric?

Post by TheNobleDrake » Wed Jun 27, 2012 5:11 pm

You could also allow a Wizard desiring to be a necromancer to learn the animate dead spell, as the book already covers a few instances where there is spell overlap (see detect magic) - and if you want it to be a different level of spell, just apply a flat modifier to the Wizard's spell check for that spell so that the numbers balance out properly (example: if you want the Wizard to get it as a spell of one level higher than the Cleric has it as, just have the Wizard roll with a -2 to his spell check.)

User avatar
Raven_Crowking
Cold-Hearted Immortal
Posts: 2931
Joined: Fri Mar 16, 2012 9:41 am

Re: Necromancer: Wizard or Cleric?

Post by Raven_Crowking » Wed Jun 27, 2012 5:34 pm

TheNobleDrake wrote:You could also allow a Wizard desiring to be a necromancer to learn the animate dead spell, as the book already covers a few instances where there is spell overlap (see detect magic) - and if you want it to be a different level of spell, just apply a flat modifier to the Wizard's spell check for that spell so that the numbers balance out properly (example: if you want the Wizard to get it as a spell of one level higher than the Cleric has it as, just have the Wizard roll with a -2 to his spell check.)
Sure...but you can also allow this as a patron spell....and, because a patron spell, without the -2.

"Well, I had to sell my soul to Orcus to raise armies of the dead, but, until someone comes along with a chainsaw hand and a boomstick, I'm golden!"
SoBH pbp:

Cathbad the Meek (herbalist Wizard 1): AC 9; 4 hp; S 7, A 7, St 10, P 17, I 13, L 8; Neutral; Club, herbs, 50' rope, 50 cp; -1 to melee attack rolls. Hideous scar.

User avatar
finarvyn
Cold-Hearted Immortal
Posts: 2481
Joined: Fri Jun 26, 2009 3:42 am
FLGS: Fair Game
Location: Chicago suburbs
Contact:

Re: Necromancer: Wizard or Cleric?

Post by finarvyn » Thu Jun 28, 2012 4:11 am

I find it interesting that the line between wizard and cleric is so blurred in the DCC RPG. (And with Appendix N literature, actually.) Both classes deal with patron or god beings to obtain their powers. Very similar. I don't see any reason why wizards couldn't heal, for example, and I'm certain if one looks at the literature there will be examples of this.

Necromancy is sort of the opposite of healing, except that the character controls death instead of controlling life. I see no reason why either cleric or wizard couldn't attempt this.
Marv / Finarvyn
DCC Minister of Propaganda; Deputized 6/8/11
DCC RPG playtester 2011, DCC Lankhmar trivia contest winner 2015; OD&D player since 1975

"The worthy GM never purposely kills players' PCs, He presents opportunities for the rash and unthinking players to do that all on their own."
-- Gary Gygax
"Don't ask me what you need to hit. Just roll the die and I will let you know!"
-- Dave Arneson

User avatar
GnomeBoy
Tyrant Master (Administrator)
Posts: 3622
Joined: Fri Mar 10, 2006 1:46 pm
FLGS: Bizarro World
Location: Left Coast, USA
Contact:

Re: Necromancer: Wizard or Cleric?

Post by GnomeBoy » Thu Jun 28, 2012 12:34 pm

finarvyn wrote:Necromancy is sort of the opposite of healing, except that the character controls death instead of controlling life. I see no reason why either cleric or wizard couldn't attempt this.
One could also say that healing is what controls death, by holding it at arm's length.

Necromancers then control un-death (to use the phrasing adopted in the rulebook) -- and that may well be off the spectrum of the life/death concept. Un-death/un-dead could be looked at as aberrations or parodies of life, something wholly other, alien, perhaps an alternate reality from our own...

Just spitballing there...
Gnome Boy • DCC playtester @ DDC 35 Feb '11. • Beta DL 2111, 7AM PT, 8 June 11.
Playing RPGs since '77 • Quasi-occasional member of the Legion of 8th-Level Fighters.

Link: Here Be 100+ DCC Monsters

bygrinstow.com

Kuruz, Mendicant, N • AC 8, 4 hp • R-1, F0, W0 • S9 A8 S9 P11 I16 L8
Zend, Grave Digger, L • AC 9, 3 hp • R-1, F0, W1 • S14 A6 S9 P13 I13 L6
Mercer, Outlaw, N • AC 12, 2 hp • R0, F-1, W1 • S7 A9 S6 P13 I8 L13
Dejah, Ropemaker, C • AC 10, 2 hp • R0, F1, W-1 • S8 A12 S15 P7 I11 L7

User avatar
Vanguard
Mighty-Thewed Reaver
Posts: 294
Joined: Sun Apr 08, 2012 3:27 pm

Re: Necromancer: Wizard or Cleric?

Post by Vanguard » Fri Jul 13, 2012 12:35 pm

I second the Wizard with a Patron idea. I'm in the middle of toying with a Lich class which will be a prototype for a Necromancer.
My Gaming Blog: The Earthlight Academy
http://earthlightacademy.blogspot.com/

User avatar
Flexi
Wild-Eyed Zealot
Posts: 96
Joined: Mon Jun 11, 2012 5:59 am
Location: England

Re: Necromancer: Wizard or Cleric?

Post by Flexi » Fri Jul 13, 2012 1:17 pm

One example from appendix N literature would be REH's Xaltotun from 'The Hour of the Dragon'. He would nicely fit the undead necromancer, a parody of life that people have mentioned above.

The line is easily blurred between the spells of a cleric and a wizard.
+1 for the suggestions of a wizard with a patron.

giant
Far-Sighted Wanderer
Posts: 23
Joined: Sat May 12, 2012 4:06 am
Contact:

Re: Necromancer: Wizard or Cleric?

Post by giant » Sat Jul 14, 2012 5:20 am

Heck, Gandalf! He lays on hands. That being said, he isn't actually a wizard . . . .

So maybe not the best example. But he claims to be a wizard and he does heal people.

User avatar
bitflipr
Wild-Eyed Zealot
Posts: 73
Joined: Tue Apr 17, 2012 11:14 am

Re: Necromancer: Wizard or Cleric?

Post by bitflipr » Tue Jul 17, 2012 8:52 pm

I just noticed today that the Charm person spell can apply to undead as well. I guess this gives +1 to the Wizard.

Post Reply

Return to “Magic and Spells”