Judges Guild?

The Judges Guild returns! Use this forum to discuss Tegal Manor, Thieves of Fortress Badabaskor, Citadel of Fire, Dark Tower, and other JG products.

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vogless
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Judges Guild?

Post by vogless » Fri Oct 20, 2006 1:18 pm

I saw on Gaming Report that you guys are doing a Judges Guild module. How's that working? I thought that was Necromancer's sacred cow.

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Post by goodmangames » Sat Oct 21, 2006 6:13 am

For now, no comment. :) Look for more details in the coming month.
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Post by Treebore » Sat Oct 21, 2006 6:36 pm

After Tegal Manor Necromancer will no longer be doing anything for Judges Guild. Other people are hopefully going to carry the "torch" from here on out.
Castles and Crusades is my game of choice!

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JG

Post by vogless » Sun Oct 22, 2006 5:23 am

As for the no comment, thanks, thats a perfectly acceptable answer. I hate silence.

As far as no more NG/JG, good too. I would definitly buy into a JG/GG union!

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Re: JG

Post by Akrasia » Tue Oct 24, 2006 6:06 am

vogless wrote: ... As far as no more NG/JG, good too...
:?

I don't think it's "good" that Necro isn't producing anymore JG stuff!

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Re: JG

Post by Sir Clarence » Tue Oct 24, 2006 6:48 am

Akrasia wrote::?

I don't think it's "good" that Necro isn't producing anymore JG stuff!
I agree. NG did an awesome job with their release of the Wilderlands Box and I would really like to see more JG material from them - which doesn't mean that I wouldn't like to see JG material from Goodman Games of course. :D Especially the one that the rumors are about (definitely my favorite JG module!).

Well, at least we can still expect Tegel Manor from NG....

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Post by Save Vs. Death Ray » Tue Oct 24, 2006 7:22 am

Where does it say GG is doing JG material? That's the holy grail of old school.

Nevermind. If I read the thread it might help. Gaming Report.

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Post by James Mishler » Tue Oct 24, 2006 9:24 am

I think it is absolutely awesome that Goodman Games will be publishing a revision of The Thieves of Fortress Badabaskor.

Can't wait for January!

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Post by DougP » Wed Nov 08, 2006 11:48 pm

As someone who is fairly ignorant of JG's history, I'm getting the impression I should be excited about this news.

:D

The module description mentions something about Dragon Kings, so it got me thinking the next obvious question - in my mind, at least - is whether these modules will either officially or conveniently fit into the Known World.

Now that I think about it, by the time I need an adventure of that level, I'm sure that at least one of the geniuses that hang out here will have done any required legwork to integrate the modules.

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Post by Sir Clarence » Thu Nov 09, 2006 1:00 am

I was actually a bit surprised to read in the press release that the adventure is for levels 10-12. The original followed the concept of starting with level 1 characters. You know what I mean: The upper dungeon levels are populated with low-level creatures and it gets tougher the deeper you get. And although this concept might be outdated today, I would have liked to see it in the new product, if only as a nod to the days of old. :)

But anyway, I'm really looking forward to Badabaskor - it always was my favorite JG module and I'm more than curious to see how it has been updated.

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Post by robertsconley » Thu Nov 09, 2006 5:20 am

Sir Clarence wrote:I was actually a bit surprised to read in the press release that the adventure is for levels 10-12. The original followed the concept of starting with level 1 characters.
The original (and new) Badabaskor are a mixed bag. The Outer Fortress and the first two levels are low level, the third level is very tough but can be avoided, and the last two levels are way tougher than the top two but not as tough as third.

A lst level party can use Badabaskor if given the right circumstances. A lot of reactions of the playtesters have been slavers, bandits, eviiiil. So if you consider the fortress as an evil place then a village of 400+ low-level bandits becomes a tough challenge. So hence the decision to rate it 10th to 12th.

I included notes at the beginning explaining this and the different ways Badabaskor could be presented.

This version is not an re-imagining or just a straight stat conversion either. I DMed Judges Guild, Badabaskor, and City-State since 1979 and it still my main fantasy campaign. Like Wilderlands of High Fantasy from Necromancer (I wrote Map 5, 8, and part of 12) I looked at the original and expanded on what was originally there.

For example there are several bandit leaders including the head guy Duke Cragen. I gave them some personality and some rivalries so you have some plot possibilities there.

Rob Conley

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Post by robertsconley » Thu Nov 09, 2006 5:31 am

DougP wrote: The module description mentions something about Dragon Kings, so it got me thinking the next obvious question - in my mind, at least - is whether these modules will either officially or conveniently fit into the Known World.
All the details of Badabaskor history are in there and how it fits with the rest of Judges Guild material. Then I have a section that breaks down the background into its essential components so that you can place them in the setting of your choice. I.e. it needs a sizable town, with a "no questions asked" quarter, one to two week journey away to fence goods, needs to have some trade routes a week or so journey away to raid. etc, etc.

In this section I mention things that are important to plot hooks in the module. The town being one or two weeks away is needed because several of the merchants in Badabaskor organize a caravan that takes the goods they fence to a market where they can sell them. Why have that plot? Because if you decide to use Badabaskor as a town then your players can discover this and turn it to their advantage as the goods on this caravan are likely to be quite valuable.

Enjoy
Rob Conley

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Known Realms

Post by vogless » Thu Nov 09, 2006 6:08 am

It would be nice to see "official" placements in the Known Realms. Not that it would be hard to do it anyway.

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Re: Known Realms

Post by robertsconley » Thu Nov 09, 2006 7:06 am

vogless wrote:It would be nice to see "official" placements in the Known Realms. Not that it would be hard to do it anyway.
I will see what I can do.

Rob Conley

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Thanks!

Post by vogless » Thu Nov 09, 2006 7:20 am

THanks Rob!. Looking forward to seeing your work. I know you can't always say, and I accept maybes and no comments. Are there plans for more modules past the 1st 3?

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Re: Thanks!

Post by robertsconley » Thu Nov 09, 2006 7:46 am

vogless wrote:THanks Rob!. Looking forward to seeing your work. I know you can't always say, and I accept maybes and no comments. Are there plans for more modules past the 1st 3?
Thanks for the kind words.

There are always plans but for now , Eostros and Goodman, have to do the best job we can on the first three. So that you guys will want to buy and play Fortress Badabaskor, Citadel of Fire, and Dark Tower. And that job consumes our energies quite nicely at the moment.

I can say that there is no lack of things that can be done with Judges Guild. Not only there is the back stock of old modules that can be upgraded there are a lot of projects that could be expanded (i.e. the Wilderness series, the portal series) and or we could use to make a sequel. Just hop over and look at the booty list on Acaeum and you will see what I mean.

http://www.acaeum.com/jg/

Rob Conley

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Post by Sir Clarence » Thu Nov 09, 2006 8:43 am

Again, thanks for the additional information, Rob. Much appreciated. :)

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Nothing

Post by vogless » Thu Nov 09, 2006 4:20 pm

Nothing, but nothing but good!

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Post by kenwig » Fri Nov 10, 2006 6:03 am

I just read the announcement about Judges Guild modules! BRAVO!!! Well Done!!!

Believe it or not, I was already planning to run Badabaskar for my Known Realms campaign!!!! Now, I don't have to convert it to v3.5! YEAH!

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Re: Thanks!

Post by WereSteve » Fri Nov 10, 2006 1:15 pm

robertsconley wrote:I can say that there is no lack of things that can be done with Judges Guild. Not only there is the back stock of old modules that can be upgraded there are a lot of projects that could be expanded (i.e. the Wilderness series, the portal series) and or we could use to make a sequel.
Yup ... more than enough material to keep somebody busy doing maps for quite some time ... :twisted:

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Post by Plaag » Fri Nov 10, 2006 6:21 pm

It will be interesting to see how these do...are the d20 conversions of Judges Guild modules just not cared for those who like Judges Guild but not d20. There has been Dark Tower and Caverns of Tharcia so far in that regard.
Or do people now want new content yet with Judges Guild style and Wilderlands based.

2007 is going to be interesting for Judges Guild that is sure.

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Post by WereSteve » Fri Nov 10, 2006 8:55 pm

Plaag wrote:It will be interesting to see how these do...are the d20 conversions of Judges Guild modules just not cared for by those who like Judges Guild but not d20. Or do people now want new content yet with Judges Guild style and Wilderlands based.
I think it is perhaps somewhere in-between.

There have been a lot of people who at one point or another were introduced to D&D in one of its many incarnations after the Judges Guild initially left the scene back in the early 80s. Meanwhile TSR/WotC has had a lot of time to attract followers of the various settings introduced along the way not to mention all the fluff brought on by the whole d20/OGL onslaught.

Any more it seems like a pretty hard sell trying to attract (most/some) gamers to a low magic setting with little to no added fluff ... then again ... I have always ascribed to the "keep it simple stupid" method of role playing. It's supposed to be fun ... not a cometition to see who is the best Munchkin/Rules Lawyer/Kender around.

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Post by gideon_thorne » Fri Nov 10, 2006 9:27 pm

WereSteve wrote:
Any more it seems like a pretty hard sell trying to attract (most/some) gamers to a low magic setting with little to no added fluff ...
Sounds like a challenging sort of game to me.

While I have a personal preference for some very off the wall settings, my own in particular; I could enjoy a 'gritty' game. Depends largely on the group I'm in and the game master running it mostly.
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Post by robertsconley » Sat Nov 11, 2006 7:48 am

Plaag wrote:It will be interesting to see how these do..
A major difference here is that there a dedicated group, Eostros, behind the effort. The Quicklink experience was disorganized, Necromancer was good but managing Judges Guild were taking Clark and Bill away from their projects. Sales factored in as well. Why break even on someone else's work when I can be doing Bard's Gate and other stuff of my own. You can't argue with that.

With Eostros we don't have any other projects other than Judges Guild. So we push it more, put more into it, and so on. With Goodman Games helping and publishing then we have the benefit of Joesph's experience which has proven invaluable so far.

Enjoy
Rob Conley[/u]

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Post by robertsconley » Sat Nov 11, 2006 8:05 am

WereSteve wrote:
Plaag wrote: Any more it seems like a pretty hard sell trying to attract (most/some) gamers to a low magic setting with little to no added fluff ... then again ... I have always ascribed to the "keep it simple stupid" method of role playing. It's supposed to be fun ... not a cometition to see who is the best Munchkin/Rules Lawyer/Kender around.
Personally I think what missing in adventures being written today is the idea that the player can win the dungeon itself. Not just clear it out and get all the stuff but actually use the dungeon/town/tower itself.

When I first started in the late 70's a lot of the end of career goals of PCs were to build a stronghold or become kings, rulers etc. Now I know there has been a lot of rules put out for D20 let alone Birthright. But back in those days a lot of time their initial base was gained by taking over a cool dungeon/fortress/tower.

When that happened you photocopied your maps and hand them over to the players and they start modified it. When I started DMing this happened to me a lot, mainly because of the JG modules I used. Then when we started a new campaign, the old characters and their stronghold became part of the NPCs and background.

Over the years I learned how to turn this idea into interesting adventures. Which lead into the development of cultures, religions, etc so players had worthy adversaries when they won their stronghold. And the definition of stronghold changed to where it could mean that you become leader of a mages or thieves guild. Or in one game the players were all members of a gyspy like culture and they wanted their clan to prosper.

One of the reasons I expanded the personalities and goals for the NPCs was not only to give interesting plot hooks but also to allow PCs to put 2 and 2 together and give them the chance to take the fortress for themselves. In one sense the ultimate treasure of Badabaskor isn't the stuff in there its the fortress itself.
Enjoy
Rob Conley

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