Levelling Up
Moderators: DJ LaBoss, michaelcurtis, finarvyn, Harley Stroh
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- Far-Sighted Wanderer
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Levelling Up
When you accumulate 10 XP as a 0 level PC, is the intention that you level up immediately i.e. in the middle of the adventure, or do you wait until the end? Having just read Sailors on the Sunless Sea, I'm thinking that if the latter, 0 levels may not make it through!
- Raven_Crowking
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Re: Levelling Up
You level up immediately.
Be aware, thought, that this doesn't necessarily mean that you have all your class abilities immediately available. Wizards must still learn spells, for instance, and Thieves need tools to perform several class functions.
Be aware, thought, that this doesn't necessarily mean that you have all your class abilities immediately available. Wizards must still learn spells, for instance, and Thieves need tools to perform several class functions.
SoBH pbp:
Cathbad the Meek (herbalist Wizard 1): AC 9; 4 hp; S 7, A 7, St 10, P 17, I 13, L 8; Neutral; Club, herbs, 50' rope, 50 cp; -1 to melee attack rolls. Hideous scar.
Cathbad the Meek (herbalist Wizard 1): AC 9; 4 hp; S 7, A 7, St 10, P 17, I 13, L 8; Neutral; Club, herbs, 50' rope, 50 cp; -1 to melee attack rolls. Hideous scar.
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- Far-Sighted Wanderer
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Re: Levelling Up
Ok, good point. Seems a bit rough on wizards not to get their initial spells though...
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- Cold-Blooded Diabolist
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Re: Levelling Up
It is a bit rough... which is why I, personally, have a few occupations count as having been studying a spell trying to get it to work (I can only remember Alchemist, Wizard's Apprentice, and I think (elven) Sage) and then finally managing that one spell upon reaching 1st level.d(sqrt(-1)) wrote:Ok, good point. Seems a bit rough on wizards not to get their initial spells though...
I also make sure that that one spell is something directly useful - either an attack spell or a defensive spell - since I firmly believe in randomly determined spells so long as they fit into the "slots" of 1 attack, 1 defense, 1 utility and the rest are free to be whatever they wish.
Re: Levelling Up
You guys are really going to level up during the adventure? Does it say to do that in the rulebook?
Leveling up on the spot doesn't make sense in an RPG and feels like a video game. It's too gamey in my opinion, but I also think it would be very difficult to finish "Sailors" with all 0-levels. Maybe I can let them choose a class they are leaning to, but only allow an extra hit dice and generic level benefits. I would rule out spells, specialized skills, anything that requires research and training is not going to just fall in their laps like a miracle. Too unbelievable for my tastes, and probably my group's as well.
Is it certain that PC's level up during the adventure from 0-level to a class like a Wizard? Does the Cleric sprout a holy symbol out of an unknown orifice?
Has anyone played with with Harley? Is this the official way it actually happens?
Leveling up on the spot doesn't make sense in an RPG and feels like a video game. It's too gamey in my opinion, but I also think it would be very difficult to finish "Sailors" with all 0-levels. Maybe I can let them choose a class they are leaning to, but only allow an extra hit dice and generic level benefits. I would rule out spells, specialized skills, anything that requires research and training is not going to just fall in their laps like a miracle. Too unbelievable for my tastes, and probably my group's as well.
Is it certain that PC's level up during the adventure from 0-level to a class like a Wizard? Does the Cleric sprout a holy symbol out of an unknown orifice?
Has anyone played with with Harley? Is this the official way it actually happens?
- Ravenheart87
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Re: Levelling Up
At my table some time would be required, because that's what makes sense for me. I was also thinking starting a party at level zero, and after the adventure, one year passes before some of the survivors meet again.
Vorpal Mace: a humble rpg blog with some DCC-related stuff.
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- Far-Sighted Wanderer
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Re: Levelling Up
It doesn't say either way AFAIK. This is a job for a pineal gland!Blustar wrote:You guys are really going to level up during the adventure? Does it say to do that in the rulebook?
p26 just says that characters level up when they reach the required XP.
p360 says "When a character accrues enough XP to advance in level he automatically acquires the benefits of that new level. No formalised training or other activity is necessary"
However p 314 says that for each level gained a wizard knows a new spell, which he must spend time to learn (~1 week/level of spell) and has to make a DC 10+spell level INT+CL check. I'm assuming that's for levels above 1st though(?)
- Raven_Crowking
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Re: Levelling Up
For your consideration: http://ravencrowking.blogspot.ca/2012/0 ... ls-on.htmld(sqrt(-1)) wrote:Ok, good point. Seems a bit rough on wizards not to get their initial spells though...
SoBH pbp:
Cathbad the Meek (herbalist Wizard 1): AC 9; 4 hp; S 7, A 7, St 10, P 17, I 13, L 8; Neutral; Club, herbs, 50' rope, 50 cp; -1 to melee attack rolls. Hideous scar.
Cathbad the Meek (herbalist Wizard 1): AC 9; 4 hp; S 7, A 7, St 10, P 17, I 13, L 8; Neutral; Club, herbs, 50' rope, 50 cp; -1 to melee attack rolls. Hideous scar.
- GnomeBoy
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Re: Levelling Up
So, the real question is: When do you hand out XP?
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Gnome Boy • DCC playtester @ DDC 35 Feb '11. • Beta DL 2111, 7AM PT, 8 June 11.
Playing RPGs since '77 • Quasi-occasional member of the Legion of 8th-Level Fighters.
Link: Here Be 100+ DCC Monsters
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- Cold-Blooded Diabolist
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Re: Levelling Up
Me, I track XP earned as it is earned and hand out the balance at the end of a session or during significant downtime for reasons other than wound-recovery - the only exception being 0-level characters who always go from 0 to 10 XP, either the instant that only a number of characters equal to the number of players survive or once the funnel adventure has been completed regardless of the number of survivors.GnomeBoy wrote:So, the real question is: When do you hand out XP?
Re: Levelling Up
I track EP's during the session, then hand them out at the end (with bonus random awards like MVP and "best crit"... whatever I feel like). I also let the players jockey, bargain and haggle for more EP's. They can then level up and adjust their character sheets if they have enough. Coming from a HackMaster background, I also let my characters go to University (once per level), where they can earn more EP's, have random events, waste all their hard-earned coin and even pickup extra skills (pottery class, anyone?).
- finarvyn
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Re: Levelling Up
I hand out XP when we get to a "convenient resting place" such as between modules. Sometimes if the group rests at the end of a session I'll peek to see if anyone would level up at that point and hand out XP right away if it would help.
I have a hard time with the idea that we might stop in the middle of a battle, quickly level up, then resume the battle. I don't think my group would enjoy breaking up the action so much.
I have a hard time with the idea that we might stop in the middle of a battle, quickly level up, then resume the battle. I don't think my group would enjoy breaking up the action so much.
Marv / Finarvyn
DCC Minister of Propaganda; Deputized 6/8/11 (over 11 years of SPAM bustin'!)
DCC RPG playtester 2011, DCC Lankhmar trivia contest winner 2015; OD&D player since 1975
"The worthy GM never purposely kills players' PCs, He presents opportunities for the rash and unthinking players to do that all on their own."
-- Gary Gygax
"Don't ask me what you need to hit. Just roll the die and I will let you know!"
-- Dave Arneson
"Misinterpreting the rules is a shared memory for many of us"
-- Joseph Goodman
DCC Minister of Propaganda; Deputized 6/8/11 (over 11 years of SPAM bustin'!)
DCC RPG playtester 2011, DCC Lankhmar trivia contest winner 2015; OD&D player since 1975
"The worthy GM never purposely kills players' PCs, He presents opportunities for the rash and unthinking players to do that all on their own."
-- Gary Gygax
"Don't ask me what you need to hit. Just roll the die and I will let you know!"
-- Dave Arneson
"Misinterpreting the rules is a shared memory for many of us"
-- Joseph Goodman
Re: Levelling Up
For anyone interested, here is the mono-chart I am using for formal training right now. Simply pick the right die for the class, modify it according to the type of institution and roll on the chart. The values are balanced so good and bad effects will happen for each class, and each class should be weighted towards certain types of education. Obviously brainy-classes do better in school than thick-headed warriors.
1 Tuition Hike *
2 Ultimate Frisby **
3 Gambling Ring (LUK) *
4 Class Rival! ***
5 Rumour Overheard
6 Messy Relationship ***
7 Secret Society Membership
8 Work-Study Job *
9 Frat Party (Random Disease)
10 Rival School! ***
11 The Art of Theater **
12 Trade Skills (Roll Random Background)
13 School Bully (-1d6 Luck)
14 Robbed! *
15 Unrequited Love! ***
16 Language Elective (INT)
17 Teacher's Pet (+1d6 EP's)
18 Class Rival! ***
19 Interpretive Dance 101 **
20 Dabbled in the Black Arts (Random Curse)
21 Library Pass ‡
22 Tuition Hike *
23 Secret Society Membership
24 Seminar on Sorcery ‡
25 School Bully (-1d6 Luck)
26 Archery (AGI)
27 Pottery Class **
28 Fencing (STR)
29 Scholarship *
30 Lecture on Enchantments ‡
* Gain/Lose 1d6 x 100 coins
** Semester wasted
*** You have made a sworn enemy
‡ Gain a spell or scroll
Warrior - 1d10
Dwarf - 1d12
Halfling - 1d14
Cleric - 1d16
Thief - 1d20
Elf - 1d24
Wizard - 1d30
Kobar: 1d4 days distant, -2 Die Types, +1d4 EP's
Guild: Class specific, 1d10 days distant, +0 Die Types, +1d6 EP's
Monastery: 1d20 days distant, -1 Die Types for non-clerics, +1 Die Types for clerics, +1d8 EP's
University: 1d30 days distant, +0 Die Types, +1d10 EP's
1 Tuition Hike *
2 Ultimate Frisby **
3 Gambling Ring (LUK) *
4 Class Rival! ***
5 Rumour Overheard
6 Messy Relationship ***
7 Secret Society Membership
8 Work-Study Job *
9 Frat Party (Random Disease)
10 Rival School! ***
11 The Art of Theater **
12 Trade Skills (Roll Random Background)
13 School Bully (-1d6 Luck)
14 Robbed! *
15 Unrequited Love! ***
16 Language Elective (INT)
17 Teacher's Pet (+1d6 EP's)
18 Class Rival! ***
19 Interpretive Dance 101 **
20 Dabbled in the Black Arts (Random Curse)
21 Library Pass ‡
22 Tuition Hike *
23 Secret Society Membership
24 Seminar on Sorcery ‡
25 School Bully (-1d6 Luck)
26 Archery (AGI)
27 Pottery Class **
28 Fencing (STR)
29 Scholarship *
30 Lecture on Enchantments ‡
* Gain/Lose 1d6 x 100 coins
** Semester wasted
*** You have made a sworn enemy
‡ Gain a spell or scroll
Warrior - 1d10
Dwarf - 1d12
Halfling - 1d14
Cleric - 1d16
Thief - 1d20
Elf - 1d24
Wizard - 1d30
Kobar: 1d4 days distant, -2 Die Types, +1d4 EP's
Guild: Class specific, 1d10 days distant, +0 Die Types, +1d6 EP's
Monastery: 1d20 days distant, -1 Die Types for non-clerics, +1 Die Types for clerics, +1d8 EP's
University: 1d30 days distant, +0 Die Types, +1d10 EP's
- Ravenheart87
- Tight-Lipped Warlock
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Re: Levelling Up
Galadrin, that's an awesome table! Far better than choosing feats. ![Smile :)](./images/smilies/icon_smile.gif)
![Smile :)](./images/smilies/icon_smile.gif)
Vorpal Mace: a humble rpg blog with some DCC-related stuff.
- finarvyn
- Cold-Hearted Immortal
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Re: Levelling Up
I second that, Galadrin! What a cool concept!
Marv / Finarvyn
DCC Minister of Propaganda; Deputized 6/8/11 (over 11 years of SPAM bustin'!)
DCC RPG playtester 2011, DCC Lankhmar trivia contest winner 2015; OD&D player since 1975
"The worthy GM never purposely kills players' PCs, He presents opportunities for the rash and unthinking players to do that all on their own."
-- Gary Gygax
"Don't ask me what you need to hit. Just roll the die and I will let you know!"
-- Dave Arneson
"Misinterpreting the rules is a shared memory for many of us"
-- Joseph Goodman
DCC Minister of Propaganda; Deputized 6/8/11 (over 11 years of SPAM bustin'!)
DCC RPG playtester 2011, DCC Lankhmar trivia contest winner 2015; OD&D player since 1975
"The worthy GM never purposely kills players' PCs, He presents opportunities for the rash and unthinking players to do that all on their own."
-- Gary Gygax
"Don't ask me what you need to hit. Just roll the die and I will let you know!"
-- Dave Arneson
"Misinterpreting the rules is a shared memory for many of us"
-- Joseph Goodman
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- Cold-Blooded Diabolist
- Posts: 525
- Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2012 1:36 am
Re: Levelling Up
That's a sweet Hack-inspired table Galadrin, and I am saving it for use... if my players ever don't know what to do with their downtime, that is...
They traded some gear for a fixer-up farm house and some land and seem obsessed with making a big fancy endeavor of turning into a grand base of operations - even though they have clear and certain plans to go further south to a larger city once their current adventure is wrapped up.
They traded some gear for a fixer-up farm house and some land and seem obsessed with making a big fancy endeavor of turning into a grand base of operations - even though they have clear and certain plans to go further south to a larger city once their current adventure is wrapped up.
Re: Levelling Up
I wouldn't level my party-mid adventure unless there was opportunity for it. I generally don't hand out XP until the end of the game though, so this rarely happens.
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- micahmoore
- Far-Sighted Wanderer
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Re: Levelling Up
Jumping from level 0 to 1 is a huge life changing moment,
something that shouldn't be rushed (even for just the logistics of
the player being able to really think about each class before choosing)
I think there should be at least a couple of days of study/reflection on
the change (especially for magic users/clerics)
A jump from say level 1 to 2 is much more negligible change.
Once they are level 1, I think leveling up instantly when you can (even in a dungeon)
is fine...the only thing requireing time back in town would be access to their new spells.
Meaning I wouldn't allow insta-access while mid adventure in a dungeon, but would allow all the
basics (additional hit points/better hit/action die,etc)
something that shouldn't be rushed (even for just the logistics of
the player being able to really think about each class before choosing)
I think there should be at least a couple of days of study/reflection on
the change (especially for magic users/clerics)
A jump from say level 1 to 2 is much more negligible change.
Once they are level 1, I think leveling up instantly when you can (even in a dungeon)
is fine...the only thing requireing time back in town would be access to their new spells.
Meaning I wouldn't allow insta-access while mid adventure in a dungeon, but would allow all the
basics (additional hit points/better hit/action die,etc)
Re: Levelling Up
I was thinking about taking some of the charts from the Hackmaster 4thed books and applying them to DCC. Some of the charts and stuff in there would work great. I remember one table when rolling for familiars on it was a tape worm (Wich could be use at night for keeping watch).
Re: Levelling Up
For my group XP is usually handed out at the end of each session, even if the party is still in a dungeon or event. Leveling up I usually try to encourage before or after our game day just to avoid losing game time. The one exception was for the funnel itself. I have run the funnel twice now, once with the Portal Under the Stars module, and once with Starless Sea. With the first module I had the funnel extend all the way through, as there wasn't a convenient moment of break. For Starless Sea my group pretty thoroughly cleared out the keep above before descending and we had a snack break after killing the beastmen in the tower, so I also used it as a level up to 1. I only had two wizards but each got one spell to start with randomly rolled, and this worked out quick and easy for everyone. For in game explanation one of the characters was an apothecary and the other a noble so it wasn't too much of a stretch for them to have a moment of insight into what was previously a hobby.