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PostPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2019 5:57 pm 
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Ill-Fated Peasant

Joined: Thu May 24, 2018 2:12 pm
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Sup all,

I have a very good/active player in our group that had developed a really cool set of Invoke Patron results for his specific patron. Many of the results are based in part on other Invoke Patron results as written (Three Fates in this case). Some of the results that were tweaked seem a little unbalanced having seen them in action though.

The Invoke Patron results of the patron "Three Fates" allows a +10 modifier for a randomly determined round in the future, kept secret by the DM until the boon comes into effect. The +10 modifier, which I believe could be anything from a spell check to an attack roll to a skill check (caster is playing cards for instance), is huge. I think the reason the designers allow this is because the player does not know when the modifier will take effect, even up until right after the action die is actually used that round(s). In other words, the player can not gauge at all when the modifier comes into effect. Two other DCC players/DMs concurred with this interpretation of Three Fates on MeWe and Discord, but I wanted to hear it straight from the GG Forum.

The player's tailored Invoke Patron results, which is from the benevolence of a more lawfully aligned higher power, give the caster (player) actual prior notice on when the boons take effect, and the boons continue on in subsequent rounds on a decent Spell Check result. This has resulted in consistent, extremely powerful (+30) results of "out of combat" spells, such as Animal Summoning, Comprehend Languages, and Magic Shield, etc. I hate to say it...but it is like a +10 Spellburn result for up to three spells if the Invoke Patron is rolled even moderately well on the spell check, without the ability damage.

I really like the concept of player developed Invoke Patron results, and I like the tweak in this instance to a more "lawfully aligned" patron. I am thinking the benefits for a "prior notice" buff should be 12-13 = +2 for one check, 14-17 = +3 for two checks, 18-19 = +4 for two checks. Any thoughts on this are welcome.

Three Fates Invoke Patron - as written on pg 348, 4th Printing:

12-13 The Fates twist the destiny of the world slightly in the castor's favor. They grant a +10 bonus to a single check, but the caster has no knowledge of when the bonus will take effect. The judge should secretly roll a randomly chosen die; the result is the round when the bonus takes effect.

14-17 The Fates warp destiny in the caster's favor. They grant a +10 bonus to three checks, but the caster has no knowledge of then the bonuses will take effect. The judge should secretly roll three randomly chosen dice to determine when the bonuses take effect.

18-19 The fates weave destiny in the caster's favor. They gran a +10 bonus to five checks, but the caster has no knowledge of when the bonuses will take effect. The judge should secretly roll five randomly chosen dice to determine when the bonuses take effect.

Player's Invoke Patron results:

12-13 The patron twists the destiny of the world slightly in the caster’s favor. He grants a +10 bonus to a
single check. The player should roll a D6 to determine the time it takes for the patron to respond and grant his beneficence; the result is the round when the bonus takes effect.

14-17 The patron warps destiny in the caster’s favor. He grants a +10 bonus to three checks. The player should roll a D4 to determine the time it takes for the patron to respond and grant his beneficence; the result is the round when the initial bonus takes effect, with the subsequent checks being granted in succeeding rounds.

18-19 The patron weaves destiny in the caster’s favor. He grants a +10 bonus to five checks. The player should roll a D3 to determine the time it takes for the patron to respond and grant his beneficence; the result is the round when the initial bonus takes effect, with the subsequent checks being granted in succeeding rounds.

Apologize if the "Three Fates" question was answered previously, but there is a little more to this particular question, so I just wanted to post it up on here :)

John


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2019 4:19 am 
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Hi John.

(1) The Judge is always right. But I appreciate that you are trying to make this work for your player, so in this case I would agree that the inability of the player to know when the Three Fates will grant their boon is a major limitation that offsets the bonus. You are right not just because the judge is always right, but because your reasoning on this is correct IMHO.

(2) If you decided not to change the player's work, there are still a few things you could do to prevent this patron from solving all of the player's problems:

* Particularly nasty patron taint and/or spellburn tables for the patron.

* Particularly weak (or no) patron spells.

* Every time invoke patron is used, the caster owes the patron a favor (per RAW). Make use of this, and make the demands equal to the power given, so that the player needs to consider long and hard whether or not to invoke their patron.

That last point, BTW, can be used to "balance" any patron, or any use of divine intervention (for clerics): Make the cost at least as high as the benefit gained, and the patron will not respond until the demand is met.

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Cathbad the Meek (herbalist Wizard 1): AC 9; 4 hp; S 7, A 7, St 10, P 17, I 13, L 8; Neutral; Club, herbs, 50' rope, 50 cp; -1 to melee attack rolls. Hideous scar.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2019 4:27 pm 
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Ill-Fated Peasant

Joined: Thu May 24, 2018 2:12 pm
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FLGS: Guild Gaming
Thanks a bundle Raven! You understood my intent perfectly.

I think I will run with the lower buffs per result with the players' prior knowledge of when the boon takes effect. I am trying to keep spell check inflation down a bit at my tables. Also, I will remember that even "mundane" Invoke Patron attempts are supposed to result in a repayment in-kind to the patron, or a task, which could be "on the spot" or at a later time of the patron's choosing.

12-13 = +2 for one check
14-17 = +3 for two checks
18-19 = +4 for two checks

Sage Advice!
John


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 26, 2019 4:42 am 
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My pleasure!

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SoBH pbp:

Cathbad the Meek (herbalist Wizard 1): AC 9; 4 hp; S 7, A 7, St 10, P 17, I 13, L 8; Neutral; Club, herbs, 50' rope, 50 cp; -1 to melee attack rolls. Hideous scar.


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