Questions about the zero level funnel

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Nyarlathotep5150
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Questions about the zero level funnel

Post by Nyarlathotep5150 »

I'm working on a DCC campaign and I had a question about the zero level funnel. I can see how it fits with dungeon traps and hazards (characters fall in a pit trap, they basically just die). My question is, for monster combat, wouldn't the strength in numbers effect far outweigh the penalty of being zero level? I mean, an Ogre is pretty powerful compared to A zero level character, but if there are 16 of them... Isn't it pretty likely that the the sheer number of attacks per round will lead to the players making mincemeat of most monsters before they even become a threat? Should the funnel have a higher number of monsters per encounter to offset the issue?
TheNobleDrake
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Re: Questions about the zero level funnel

Post by TheNobleDrake »

To use your example of an ogre, and elaborate upon how 0-levels stand up in my experience, I'll break things into the different moving parts.

1. Initiative - the Ogre has +2, which is better than most 0 levels characters. He is very likely to go before most of the players, since their using group initiative (1 roll per player, rather than per character) reduces the chances of a lucky roll beating him.

2. Ogre attacking Characters - the Ogre has +5, which means very good chances of hitting the 0-level characters who likely don't even have armor (80% accuracy against most 0-level characters). Add to that that a 0-level character has to have the right birth augur (adding luck mod to HP) to even have a chance at not being killed in one hit.

3. Characters attacking Ogre - the typical 0-level character tends to have roughly +0 attack bonus, and deals 1d4 or 1d6 damage in the vast majority of cases. That means 25% accuracy against the ogre's 16 AC, and a rough average of 7 hits needed to kill the ogre.

Using that math (which I rounded quite a bit of, you will have to excuse me, it is late) you can see that the "average" encounter with 16 characters and an ogre at 0-level would be something like the following:

Round 1 - Ogre kills 1 character, gets hit a few times.
Round 2 - Ogre kills 1 character, gets hit a few more times
Round 3 - Ogre kills 1 character, finally gets killed by the remaining 13 0-level characters.

...and the only thing that puts a significant change to the above scenario is if a player happens to roll a crit, but then it is intentional for things to go gonzo when playing DCC, so you should just embrace that.
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tovokas
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Re: Questions about the zero level funnel

Post by tovokas »

Most funnels work through gradual attrition as the mob moves toward a clear goal - so the threats (in general) grow more focused as the adventure goes on since you assume the mob is getting smaller and smaller. In that regard, each individual encounter is not terribly important, it's the cumulative effect that is the main design driver.

The key to a fun funnel is to keep things moving, so I'd suggest the last thing you want to do is throw a mob of foes at the mob of characters. 16-20 serfs battling 16-20 weak monsters, each with a 50% or lower chance of hitting each other will turn into a dice-rolling death march quicker than you can say 40-400! Also, the players are hopefully treating their characters as actual breathing folk who want to live, generally unwilling to sacrifice themselves as fodder in a pitched battle unless absolutely necessary.

So the Ogre that kills with every swing might be 'mincemeat' in a few rounds to 16 coordinated foes... but the mob of serfs is probably far from organized, and who wants to be the first to venture into the Ogre's killing range? Major threats should be something the mob wants to get past, not necessarily crush in battle.

Of course, you can create marquee encounters (like the big battle at the end) that throw all this out on its ear. But even these battles need to be carefully crafted so the action stays swift, and as a judge you can reasonably keep track of the mayhem each round. Converting a big baddie to 2 or 4 lesser foes is fine, but always keep an eye on how such changes will effect the pace of the battle.
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Skyscraper
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Re: Questions about the zero level funnel

Post by Skyscraper »

In my few (two) experiences through 0-level funnels, we had no mob attacks. Only single monsters, and once we had 3 monsters (vs about 12 characters).

In the game I judge, there was for example a fight between one 6-hit point monster and 15 characters. One character almost died by strangulation. Of course, the PCs won the battle.

In another battle, the PCs wanted to enter a witch's hut in a swamp. They did not know that it was protected by a straw golem. They opened the door and thought it was a scarecrow. They went it. The strawman attacked, critted, and broke one PC's arm (who incredibly survived). They exited the hut and the straw golem did not pursue. They killed it from afar, throwing large rocks that one dwarf PC had as his starting item. It might seem like an imbalanced encounter in that the PCs' victory was never at stake. But it was quite fun I think. And one PC had a broken arm for the rest of the entire funnel (another 3 sessions).

In each case, the point was not to get a balanced battle. The point, for the players, was to avoid one PC being killed. When you're a judge, you tend to look at the characters as a mob. Not so for the players. They each have some minimal attachment to each of their funnel PCs. They want that farmer or shaman to survive.

As mentioned above, PC attrition will occur during the funnel. If you have your PCs fight a mob, the funnel will be one battle :)
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