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PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2015 9:30 pm 
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Far-Sighted Wanderer
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Joined: Sun Nov 29, 2015 12:19 pm
Posts: 17
I know this is a touchy subject for some, so please don't maul the messenger.

Since DCC is all about houseruling, I'm curious how people who have separated race and class have done it in their game. I like to get feedback from other judges on their experiences before tinkering myself, so I'd love to hear what people have done.

Yes, I know some comedians are going to say, "The best way is not to do it at all!" and I support your interpretation. But for those who HAVE done it, or considered doing it, what are the thoughts?

It seems to me that two major missteps in the races separate from classes originally was (1) attaching stat bonuses and (2) making all beings of one race (especially humans) so similar. Stat bonuses seem to necessarily attract min-maxing, while blanket racial abilities seem to make humans, as the "default race," sort of vanilla in comparison. I don't think "can be any class" is a good enough racial bonus, especially as it doesn't help someone who only wants to play a class everyone can be. Infravision, also, seems an issue to me in a game with so much time in darkness.

Is it better to go by culture instead? So make, for example, a Viking cultural choice with abilities that would suit both Nordic-flavored humans and dwarves designed to hail from a culture with similar values?

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SILAS, L, Ostler, S14, A13, S12, P11, I14, L5, AC11, HP3, Staff +1 1d4+1, Init 1, R +1, F0, W0, 10' Chain, Bridle, Path of the bear (Melee damage rolls), Com +1

PERCIVAL, N, Halfling dyer, S12, A10, S9, P13, I6, L12, AC10, HP2, Staff +0 1d4, Init 0, R0, F0, W+1, Small sack, 3 yards fabric, Righteous heart (Turn unholy checks), Com

DERVOS, N, Corn Farmer, S13, A8, S8, P12, I13, L13, AC9, HP 1, Pitchfork +1 1d8+2, Init -1, R-1, F-1, W0, Waterskin, hen, Path of the bear (Melee damage rolls) (+1) Com +1

EIBUR, C, Potato Farmer, S8, A7, S12, P11, I13, L7, AC 9, HP 2, Pitchfork -1 1d8-1, Init -1, R-1, F0, W0, Torch, Goat, Struck by lightning (Reflex saving throws) Com +1


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 06, 2015 5:01 am 
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Chaos-Summoning Sorcerer
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Joined: Wed Jan 05, 2011 3:34 pm
Posts: 862
Location: Győr, Hungary
I gave each race a few bonus abilities and some penalties, eg. dwarves had infravision, the underground skills of the dwarf class, plus slow movement speed. Each race had its own zero level profession chart too. Characters could increase a single attribute every third level. The human racial bonus was the ability to increase a single attribute on zero level, and on every even level. It wasn't a balanced campaign, but who cares, it was an awful lot of fun, plus good abilities and bonuses don't guarantee survival thanks to DCC RPG's chaotic nature. Strangely all my players wanted to roll for race, and they've kept this habit during the whole campaign.

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 20, 2016 6:09 pm 
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Gongfarmer

Joined: Sun Mar 20, 2016 6:01 pm
Posts: 2
FLGS: fanatix
I guys! I hope this isn't hijacking the thread. but it seemed as though this might be a good place to ask this. We are just getting started with the game, and just had our first group of characters make it to 1st level. Yay us. :) Anyway, I am just wondering, if a o level character is rolled up as a dwarven mushroom farmer, when he makes first level does he HAVE to become a dwarf, or can he instead select warrior or thief or whatever. I thought you could, but our GM says no, if you are rolled up as a dwarf, you must select dwarf when you make 1st level. Is this true? Thanks


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2016 7:53 am 
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Cold-Hearted Immortal
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Joined: Fri Mar 16, 2012 9:41 am
Posts: 2719
It is true by the Rules As Written, rawlkeer81....but your judge can change the rules in any way that he likes to better fit his vision of the game.

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Cathbad the Meek (herbalist Wizard 1): AC 9; 4 hp; S 7, A 7, St 10, P 17, I 13, L 8; Neutral; Club, herbs, 50' rope, 50 cp; -1 to melee attack rolls. Hideous scar.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2016 11:33 am 
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Gongfarmer

Joined: Sun Mar 20, 2016 6:01 pm
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FLGS: fanatix
I'm sure he doesn't want to go in for any changes, like I said we just started and it's much too early to begin tinkering with RAW. Thanks for the response!


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2016 5:16 pm 
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Hard-Bitten Adventurer

Joined: Fri Aug 07, 2015 6:27 pm
Posts: 128
FLGS: Everybody Reads
Your GM might be persuaded to use some additional materials that have come out since the RAW was created. There is, for instance, a zine, Crawl, that has introduced a number of new classes like the Dwarven Priest, to give players more options with classes.

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MoD Demi-humans
Elrod, Elven Sage - 2hp, 11AC, HP: 2, str16(+2) agl13(+1) sta8(-1) per15(+1) int10(0) luc10(0); init: 1; ref(1), fort(-1), wil(1)
Pitchfork +2 (1d8+2); Chest: (rope (50'), Parchment, quill pen, 15 cp)

Celebron, Elven Barrister - 2hp, 10AC, str11(0) agl9(0) sta11(0) per12(0) int15(+1) luc5(-2); init: 0; ref(0), fort(0), wil(0); Lucky Sign: Hawkeye (Missile fire damage rolls) (1)
Dagger (1d4), Quill (1d4+1); Lg Sack: (Book, Candle, Torches (3), 20 cp)

Halfling, Halfling Vagrant - 4hp, 10AC, str11(0) agl9(0) sta12(0) per9(0) int14(+1) luc10(0); init: 0; ref(0), fort(2), wil(0); Lucky Sign: Lived through famine (Fortitude saving throws) (+2)
Club (1d4); Lg Sack: (Begging Bowl, Oil Flask, Flint+Steel, Iron Spikes 3)

Legolad, Elven Falconer - 1hp, 10AC, str8(-1) agl9(0) sta15(+1) per7(-1) int13(+1) luc14(+1); init: 0; ref(0), fort(1), wil(1); Lucky Sign: Survived the plague (Magical healing) (1)
Dagger -1 (1d4-1); Lg Sack: (Torches 2, Chalk 2); Falcon, Aerandir


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2016 5:37 pm 
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Deft-Handed Cutpurse

Joined: Thu Apr 09, 2009 5:14 pm
Posts: 238
Location: Teleports at will.
I have separated race from class several different ways.

The first way was to just start off with a zero level character who was a dwarf shoemakers (or whatever) and just pick warrior (or whatever) for him and just make being a Elf part of the fluff. This way seemed to work pretty well but had no mechanical backups for the Elven warrior.

The second way was much more a pain in the arse and it had ben sit down with the book and take out everything that made Dwarf feel like a dwarf ect.. and make those things race abilities and then just let them pick class like normal.

Now this made it so human was a clearly weaker race. So I then toned each race back a ways and just left the core abilities there. Humans were still the weaker race but it wasn't THAT bad off.

Then I gave humans a extra benefit to make up for it. I gave them the ability to swap out any two ability scores. For instance if my 12 strength and 15 Int fisherman made 1st level and wanted to become a farmer when I leveled him up I got to make his Str 15 and his Int 12.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 30, 2016 7:38 am 
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Cold-Hearted Immortal
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Joined: Fri Mar 10, 2006 1:46 pm
Posts: 3198
Location: Left Coast, USA
FLGS: Bizarro World
rawlkeer81 wrote:
I'm sure he doesn't want to go in for any changes, like I said we just started and it's much too early to begin tinkering with RAW. Thanks for the response!

Bullet point four on page 314 says it's never too early. :wink:

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Gnome Boy • DCC playtester @ DDC 35 Feb '11. • Beta DL 2111, 7AM PT, 8 June 11.
Playing RPGs since '77 • Quasi-occasional member of the Legion of 8th-Level Fighters.

Link: Here Be DCC Monsters

PbP Purple Planeteers!

Havarth • Cleric/Zikcub • Animal trainr • L
S11 A11 S9 P15 I9 L7
AC10, HP12, R0 F1 W2
Glaive+0 1-10
Club+0 1-4
X' chain, sack
Bless, Dtct Ev, Prot fm Evil, Word oCmmnd

Lucius • Cleric/Verlore • Slave • N
S13 A11 S8 P15 I11 L11
AC10+, HP6, R0 F0 W2
Sword+1 _
Club+1 2-5
Hide armor, flint/steel, green stone, oil 1
Crit table +1
Dark, Holy Sanct, Resist Cold/Heat, Word o Cmmnd

Toby • Squire
S13 A10 S14 P15 I16 L9
AC10+, hp3, R0 F1 W1
Lg swrd+1 2-9
Scale armor, sack, helm, L’ rope, torch • Com, Chaos, Hobgob

Kelven • Smuggler
S14 A8 S11 P12 I7 L10
AC9+, hp2(4), In-1, R-1 F0 W0
Sword+1 _
Staff+1 or Sling -1 2-5
Scale armr, waterprf sack, L’ rope, torch, 39cp

Runes:https://i.imgur.com/xGUofHk.jpg
RIP
Stinky Pete, Ostler — Spine snapped by tackling Kith


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2016 11:52 am 
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Far-Sighted Wanderer

Joined: Tue Apr 12, 2016 12:45 am
Posts: 23
FLGS: I have none.
Mostly just fluff, in my case. Elves and dwarves get to see in the dark and live for a really long time and such, halflings get to be small and lucky, humans get the bonus of being bloody everywhere and not subject to racism or wonder or stereotyping or anything else like that. Peasants can be so prejudiced.

If I were to ever add any stat bonuses then humans would get to have a point wherever they like.


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