Metal Gods of Ur-Hadad #4-6: Abandoned Kickstarter?

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herecomethejudge
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Metal Gods of Ur-Hadad #4-6: Abandoned Kickstarter?

Post by herecomethejudge » Wed Apr 29, 2020 11:21 am

It looks like there's another Brave Halfling Publishing situation going on at the Metal Gods of Ur-Hadad #4-6 Kickstarter. Three issues were promised for July through September 2019 by creator Adam Muszkiewicz, over $7000 was pledged, and absolutely nothing has been produced so far (April 29 2020). Any other backers here, and is GG aware of the situation?

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Re: Metal Gods of Ur-Hadad #4-6: Abandoned Kickstarter?

Post by Raven_Crowking » Wed Apr 29, 2020 12:03 pm

I am a backer.

I hope that these issues are produced.
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Re: Metal Gods of Ur-Hadad #4-6: Abandoned Kickstarter?

Post by herecomethejudge » Wed Apr 29, 2020 8:11 pm

I hope they are too. It's looking highly doubtful as Adam has posted a couple of "updates" this winter which consisted of two pieces of art -- basically what you would expect as a teaser going IN to the project, not long after it was due -- and a half-apology. No updated timetables, nothing. And no new updates for two months now. Weird since he was able to get issues 1-3 done, so he had an idea of what was involved in getting a project like this published.

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Re: Metal Gods of Ur-Hadad #4-6: Abandoned Kickstarter?

Post by Jim Skach » Thu Apr 30, 2020 5:09 am

I have trust (ETA: Adam is good people).

He will either do it or he won't. If he doesn't, I assume he has a good reason. If he does, it will be awesome - even it takes another three years.

This is why I tend to limit my KS to people I know, or people trusted by people I know. That way I can look at it like a patron (in the old sense of the word, not a Patron from DCC!). I put the money in - whatever comes out is great. If that's nothing, then usually I've just helped a friend or a company in which I have faith, or both (see: Goodman Games).

My lord...I'm just getting my Marmoreal Tomb stuff. I suspect when all is said and done it will be a beautiful piece of work. God knows if I'll ever see anything out of the two, count 'em two, D&D documentaries into which I dumped money back in the day (at least 5 or more years now).

Artists are flaky. I prefer to just given the ones I know the money and see what they come up with...and then have patience.

IMHO, YMMV, etc.

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Re: Metal Gods of Ur-Hadad #4-6: Abandoned Kickstarter?

Post by herecomethejudge » Thu Apr 30, 2020 8:30 am

"Artists are flaky" is hella weak, not to mention insulting to artists. I've backed quite a few KS projects and have never had one fall through like this before.

"He will either do it or he won't" is also just an obvious statement of fact, not a defense. The question is, at what point are refunds in order if it turns out that "he won't"? There is a community to be accountable to here. Dude just stole $7K if he doesn't deliver, and so far, we're about 9 months behind schedule with literally zero explanation, not a single issue out of 3 promised, and no updated timetables.

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Re: Metal Gods of Ur-Hadad #4-6: Abandoned Kickstarter?

Post by catseye yellow » Thu Apr 30, 2020 11:47 am

i don't know. stuff happens. when you support a KS you are taking a risk. it is not the same as ordering a book from amazon. in a way you are commisioning a thing from an artist and sometimes inspiration dries up and life catches you unaware.

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Re: Metal Gods of Ur-Hadad #4-6: Abandoned Kickstarter?

Post by Jim Skach » Thu Apr 30, 2020 1:49 pm

herecomethejudge wrote:
Thu Apr 30, 2020 8:30 am
"Artists are flaky" is hella weak, not to mention insulting to artists.
It's a compliment.
herecomethejudge wrote:
Thu Apr 30, 2020 8:30 am
I've backed quite a few KS projects and have never had one fall through like this before.
Then you are lucky. As catseye points out - it's a risk, not a purchase. Once I came to that perspective, I changed the way I backed.
herecomethejudge wrote:
Thu Apr 30, 2020 8:30 am
"He will either do it or he won't" is also just an obvious statement of fact, not a defense.
Defense? Who is putting up a defense? Is this an Inquiry of some sort? Do I need a lawyer?
herecomethejudge wrote:
Thu Apr 30, 2020 8:30 am
The question is, at what point are refunds in order if it turns out that "he won't"? There is a community to be accountable to here. Dude just stole $7K if he doesn't deliver, and so far, we're about 9 months behind schedule with literally zero explanation, not a single issue out of 3 promised, and no updated timetables.
Fourth wave, man. Fourth wave.

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Re: Metal Gods of Ur-Hadad #4-6: Abandoned Kickstarter?

Post by catseye yellow » Sat May 02, 2020 1:48 am

i mean i understand people getting upset to an extent. i am geek and love to get stuff BUT creators are people, deadlines are really not conductive to creativity, sometimes you overreach and sometimes stuff happens (like losing your day job or, on a happier note, becoming a parent). i have unlimited patience and understanding for creators.

and on another note: this 7000$ has probably already been spent on the project. they didn't STEAL anything and there was obviously no fraudulent intent on their part.

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Re: Metal Gods of Ur-Hadad #4-6: Abandoned Kickstarter?

Post by catseye yellow » Sat May 02, 2020 1:52 am

that said i would probably be tempted to burglarize into marc bruner's house to get DCC dying earth rules so who am i to judge?

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Re: Metal Gods of Ur-Hadad #4-6: Abandoned Kickstarter?

Post by herecomethejudge » Sun May 03, 2020 8:50 am

Jim Skach wrote:
Thu Apr 30, 2020 1:49 pm
herecomethejudge wrote:
Thu Apr 30, 2020 8:30 am
"Artists are flaky" is hella weak, not to mention insulting to artists.
It's a compliment.
It really isn't though. Plenty of artists set deadlines and meet them and refund their clients if they can't deliver. Those who don't, don't keep getting work.
Jim Skach wrote:
Thu Apr 30, 2020 1:49 pm
herecomethejudge wrote:
Thu Apr 30, 2020 8:30 am
The question is, at what point are refunds in order if it turns out that "he won't"? There is a community to be accountable to here. Dude just stole $7K if he doesn't deliver, and so far, we're about 9 months behind schedule with literally zero explanation, not a single issue out of 3 promised, and no updated timetables.
Fourth wave, man. Fourth wave.
I have no idea what this means. I'm far from the only person pissed off about this KS or the way Adam Muszkiewicz has been handling it though.

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Re: Metal Gods of Ur-Hadad #4-6: Abandoned Kickstarter?

Post by herecomethejudge » Sun May 03, 2020 8:58 am

catseye yellow wrote:
Sat May 02, 2020 1:48 am
i mean i understand people getting upset to an extent. i am geek and love to get stuff BUT creators are people, deadlines are really not conductive to creativity, sometimes you overreach and sometimes stuff happens (like losing your day job or, on a happier note, becoming a parent). i have unlimited patience and understanding for creators.

and on another note: this 7000$ has probably already been spent on the project. they didn't STEAL anything and there was obviously no fraudulent intent on their part.
Things do happen. I also backed the Umerica two-shot, part of which has been taking a while. But it's all good because there are regular updates and explanations, and it never feels like the creator dropped the ball or just abandoned it, which is definitely the case with Metal Gods. There's a way to handle it and a way not to handle it, and Adam Muszkiewicz has chosen the way not to handle it.

The $7000 probably already has been spent? On what? The project is a tiny, black-and-white zine. Literally not a thing has been produced so far.

Taking money with the promise of giving something in return and then not doing so is indeed stealing. We also have no idea what the intent was, fraudulent or not, so that's not a claim anyone should make.

Finally, "deadlines are not conducive to creativity" is a poor excuse for promising three zines starting in July 2019 and having absolutely nothing ten months later.

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Re: Metal Gods of Ur-Hadad #4-6: Abandoned Kickstarter?

Post by GnomeBoy » Sun May 03, 2020 9:43 am

herecomethejudge wrote:
Sun May 03, 2020 8:58 am
The $7000 probably already has been spent? On what? The project is a tiny, black-and-white zine. Literally not a thing has been produced so far.
To be fair, we don't know what he may have already paid out to artists and writers whose work has been completed. A finished zine isn't out yet, but that doesn't mean nothing has been done.
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Re: Metal Gods of Ur-Hadad #4-6: Abandoned Kickstarter?

Post by catseye yellow » Wed May 06, 2020 2:07 am

herecomethejudge wrote:
Sun May 03, 2020 8:58 am
catseye yellow wrote:
Sat May 02, 2020 1:48 am
i mean i understand people getting upset to an extent. i am geek and love to get stuff BUT creators are people, deadlines are really not conductive to creativity, sometimes you overreach and sometimes stuff happens (like losing your day job or, on a happier note, becoming a parent). i have unlimited patience and understanding for creators.

and on another note: this 7000$ has probably already been spent on the project. they didn't STEAL anything and there was obviously no fraudulent intent on their part.
Things do happen. I also backed the Umerica two-shot, part of which has been taking a while. But it's all good because there are regular updates and explanations, and it never feels like the creator dropped the ball or just abandoned it, which is definitely the case with Metal Gods. There's a way to handle it and a way not to handle it, and Adam Muszkiewicz has chosen the way not to handle it.

The $7000 probably already has been spent? On what? The project is a tiny, black-and-white zine. Literally not a thing has been produced so far.

Taking money with the promise of giving something in return and then not doing so is indeed stealing. We also have no idea what the intent was, fraudulent or not, so that's not a claim anyone should make.

Finally, "deadlines are not conducive to creativity" is a poor excuse for promising three zines starting in July 2019 and having absolutely nothing ten months later.

it is not poor excuse. it is plain truth. i write for a living and it can be really hard. it helps when you have good editors, caring publishers and helpful colleagues but if you are one man band it can get pretty tough, pretty quick.

so, as i said you have backed small fanzine - thousand things could have gone south.

also, adam has already probably paid artists and writers. i mean i understand disappointment but i think that you are wrong in calling on goodman to police dcc kickstarters. not to mention that it still might get done.

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Re: Metal Gods of Ur-Hadad #4-6: Abandoned Kickstarter?

Post by Vanguard » Wed May 06, 2020 5:34 am

Small creative projects like these are extremely susceptible to delays because, as others have noted, there are so many things that can happen to throw timelines off. Real life stuff like employment or relationship changes, as well as game-adjacent stuff like playtesting taking longer, gaming groups collapsing, revisions, etc all would impact this. A 6 month or longer delay is completely realistic. Now factor that that world has gone sideways and will remain so for some time.

Another thing to consider about backing a smaller kickstarter (beyond the risks outlined) is that you're not dealing with a business but a passionate fan/creator. They might be great at coming up with new game content but less adept at project management or communications. It's understandably frustrating, but there likely isn't any mal intent here.
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Re: Metal Gods of Ur-Hadad #4-6: Abandoned Kickstarter?

Post by Raven_Crowking » Thu May 07, 2020 5:32 am

Personally, I am very happy with the first three issues of Metal Gods, and I certainly expect to be happy with the next three.

It is not unreasonable to get a bit antsy under the circumstances, but I am not personally concerned. I expect that the Metal Gods will appear once more.
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Re: Metal Gods of Ur-Hadad #4-6: Abandoned Kickstarter?

Post by catseye yellow » Thu May 07, 2020 8:47 am

METAL GODS WILL RISE ONCE AGAIN!

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