Goodman Games

Just an editing fluke maybe...

The rules say 0-lvl characters are trained with one weapon, but then it says the weapon training penalty is waived for 0-lvl characters. But, since they are all trained in a weapon from their occupation, there wouldn't be a penalty in the first place. Unless they grab a fallen comrade's or foe's weapon, of course.

Also, would that training from their occupation carry over into their into their 1st lvl class?

If a 0-level character handles multiple weapons over his career, he is considered trained in the last weapon he fought with. At 1st level, a character gains training in additional weapons, based on the class he chooses.

Generally, using a weapon without training imposes a -4 attack penalty. However, this penalty is waived for 0-level characters. It is assumed their naturally poor combat abilities reflect equal incompetence with the martial use of all weapons. (Not to mention that in playtests, applying the -4 penalty increases the 0-level death rate to absurd proportions.)

From page 16 it stats that he is considered trained in the last weapon he fought with. Thus a character trained with a club could pick up a Longsword and attack without penalty at 0 level, despite not receiving training in it. If he then used it and levelled up to level 1 he would have training in Longsword, not the club.

The editting is a bit weird but I am sure that's how it works.

chokehazard wrote:would that training from their occupation carry over into their into their 1st lvl class?

It does, so you can have a wizard trained in using a shovel as a weapon.

I just asked a similar question. So club boy can use any wpn as a 0 level, with no penalty, and as soon as he hit's level one, whatever he last use, that prof "carries over"?

Oh, they are considered trained with last weapon they fought with. Now, I get it. The wording wasn't clicking for me because I was thinking their "career" was their former "occupation" because a PC isn't going to be 0 lvl for long.

Wouldn't it be easier to just say they are trained with their occupational weapon and not trained with anything else and therefore get the penalty for using a different weapon? Then you don't have to ignore fundamental rules simply because you are just starting your adventuring career.

Hi guys,

Welcome to the game and welcome to the boards! I'm glad you are here.

There is a mantra you will hear repeated many, many times on these boards: "reading the rules and playing the game are two very different things."

I agree that, logically, a -4 penalty for untrained weapons should apply at level 0 just as much as at level 1...and that it seems odd that only one of the level 0 "trained weapons" carries over to level 1.

In the "early days" of DCC RPG, I played many sessions where I applied that -4 penalty to level 0 characters who went outside their trained weapons. Those games were, quite simply, not much fun. The game is a lot more fun if level 0 characters (who are bad enough to begin with) simply "roll to hit," then the weapon training kicks in at level 1.

It's a rule that "reads" kinda weird but "plays" great.

There's another thread on these boards that covers the same territory. And, in fact, one of the people in that thread, who made a similar to point to what you're making, then ran two level-0 sessions...and then acknowledged that the game does "play" better when you waive the -4 penalty. Here's the thread:

http://www.goodmangames.com/forums/view ... 69&t=14565

Anyway, I'd encourage you to come to your own conclusions -- preferably by playing a couple sessions. Definitely try both ways (rules-as-written and with your own tweaks) and give your feedback. The game is still in beta and things can change.

Thanks,
Joseph

Here's an idea, what if instead of having a -4 non prof penalty, the bonus to hit from your class is your profiency penalty? It represents that you are trained in some wpns, but other wpns you ahve no training in

so a 0 level char is +0 with everything

a, for example, 3rd level cleric is +2 with his proficient wpns, and +0 with everything else

ogbendog wrote:so a 0 level char is +0 with everything

a, for example, 3rd level cleric is +2 with his proficient wpns, and +0 with everything else

I like this. It makes more sense than having a character using a battleaxe at lvl 0, then using another weapon, then leveling to wizard and discovering that if she picks up again the battleaxe she's worse than before at using it!

I wonder whether it's balanced for the mid- to high-level games.

My personal interpretation of this rule would be that you get the -4 penalty for the first round of combat with a new weapon, but then the penalty is waived, as you get the hang of it.