a question about installing steampowers on mechs

Medieval fantasy mechs powered by steam, magic, or the labor of a thousand slaves.

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modus666
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a question about installing steampowers on mechs

Post by modus666 » Sun Dec 09, 2007 10:49 pm

say i wish to install some steam powers in my mech to make it better. the dragonmech book mentions the possibility of having to 'scale up' the steam powers in size to work on a mech. but there is not indication given for the exact mechanic.

does a steampower have to be scaled up to be the same size as the mech its installed on? if so that wouldnt make much sense for many of the powers.

here's an example...

the springbox pwoer from steam warriors, pg 90, says "The device, mech, or steamborg gains the benefit of the Run feat." A spring box is size small by default and weighs 5 lbs. what changes would need to be made to install it in, say, a colossal mech like the bastion?

mythfish
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Post by mythfish » Mon Dec 10, 2007 1:16 pm

On page 55 of the core book right before the list of steam powers is a section entitled "Building Steam Powers of Different Sizes". It indicates that you can build a steam power for sizes up to Gargantuan with only an increase in cost and weight.

I vaguely recall reading something about combining steam powers to affect larger mechs, but I can't seem to find it now. Maybe I'm thinking of spells and the Combine Spell feat. In any case, I don't think it would be unreasonable to require a coglayer to build two Gargantuan springboxes to affect a Colossal mech. Or extrapolate from table 2-2 on page 72 and figure that if a Large mech is 10 ft high, a steam power built for a Large mech can affect 10 ft worth of mech. So for a Colossal mech at 35 ft, you would need 3.5 Large spring boxes (or I suppose a Large springbox and a Gargantuan springbox). Does that make sense?

I think a DM would also be well within his rights to simply say you can't apply steam powers like a springbox to mechs larger than Gargantuan.
Dieter Zimmerman
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modus666
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Post by modus666 » Mon Dec 10, 2007 10:05 pm

mythfish wrote:On page 55 of the core book right before the list of steam powers is a section entitled "Building Steam Powers of Different Sizes". It indicates that you can build a steam power for sizes up to Gargantuan with only an increase in cost and weight.

<snip>...In any case, I don't think it would be unreasonable to require a coglayer to build two Gargantuan springboxes to affect a Colossal mech. Or extrapolate from table 2-2 on page 72 and figure that if a Large mech is 10 ft high, a steam power built for a Large mech can affect 10 ft worth of mech. So for a Colossal mech at 35 ft, you would need 3.5 Large spring boxes (or I suppose a Large springbox and a Gargantuan springbox). Does that make sense?

I think a DM would also be well within his rights to simply say you can't apply steam powers like a springbox to mechs larger than Gargantuan.
ohhhh kay.that last bit seems a bit off. there is mention of high-level gearwrights with mechs tricked out with steam powers in a couple of places but i dont remember seeing naything that limited them to gargantuan size. considering the SMALL number of mechs that are small than at least colossal saying a coglayer cannot build steampowers into a mech larger than that is a bit unfair. any of the really combat-worthy mechs i've seen are no smaller than colossal, usually bigger. so i would definitely urge a DM not to limit steampower integration to colossal or smaller.

i'll re-read the section on building larger steam powers again and get back to you on the rest.

for the record i've really enjoyed your responses to my questions Mythfish. i'm glad you've taken the time to respond because my newly founded dragonmech game has really grabbed my players and i plan on running it for awhile.

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Post by mythfish » Mon Dec 10, 2007 10:28 pm

modus666 wrote: for the record i've really enjoyed your responses to my questions Mythfish. i'm glad you've taken the time to respond because my newly founded dragonmech game has really grabbed my players and i plan on running it for awhile.
I was supposed to be working on DragonMech Battles today. Now if it's not ready to be released on time I'll blame you. :P
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modus666
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>sigh<

Post by modus666 » Tue Dec 11, 2007 10:03 am

do wacha gotta do man.

animefunkmaster
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Post by animefunkmaster » Tue Dec 11, 2007 4:50 pm

modus666 wrote: considering the SMALL number of mechs that are small than at least colossal saying a coglayer cannot build steampowers into a mech larger than that is a bit unfair. any of the really combat-worthy mechs i've seen are no smaller than colossal, usually bigger.
I disagree. While it is true the most dangerous mechs out there have a substantial size there are plenty of smaller mechs that can pack a punch.

Example from a game I am currently DMing:
A mech jockey in the party wants to be the pilot of a personal mech. The story is not centered around mech combat but rather the draconic prophecy (Eberron/Dragonmech mix, future eberron essentially). There is little in the way of large scale mech combat that is unavoidable. We are level 8, and the jockey just built his first mech.

He made an Ashigaru, iron tooth clan large sized mech, mech manual. This thing is a power house. He went from a dexterous, skillful character to the tank in no time flat. Not only did it make him the fastest character but nearly the strongest. Sure it takes down his dexterous combat style but now add in mechidexteritous and he can move and attack twice. Its definatly not ground breaking but it is in no way lacking in power... not to mention the gold he put into it is a meer 750 gp, pennies compared to a magical equivalent.

modus666
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Post by modus666 » Wed Dec 12, 2007 10:09 am

animefunkmaster wrote: Example from a game I am currently DMing:
A mech jockey in the party wants to be the pilot of a personal mech. The story is not centered around mech combat but rather the draconic prophecy (Eberron/Dragonmech mix, future eberron essentially). There is little in the way of large scale mech combat that is unavoidable. We are level 8, and the jockey just built his first mech.

He made an Ashigaru, iron tooth clan large sized mech, mech manual. This thing is a power house. He went from a dexterous, skillful character to the tank in no time flat. Not only did it make him the fastest character but nearly the strongest. Sure it takes down his dexterous combat style but now add in mechidexteritous and he can move and attack twice. Its definatly not ground breaking but it is in no way lacking in power... not to mention the gold he put into it is a meer 750 gp, pennies compared to a magical equivalent.
when you stand the ashigaru wielding character against the standard D&D encounter, well, yes they are quite a bit more potent. stand that same character up against a colossal III sized mech with multiple steamcannons trained on it and things shift quite a bit.

the point i was making was not so much about smaller mexhs being worthless, it was that coglayers shouldnt be limited to installing steampowers in smaller mechs only.

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Post by mythfish » Wed Dec 12, 2007 1:34 pm

modus666 wrote: the point i was making was not so much about smaller mexhs being worthless, it was that coglayers shouldnt be limited to installing steampowers in smaller mechs only.
I wasn't trying to suggest that no steam powers should be able to be installed on larger mechs...just the ones that affect the entire mech rather than part of the mech, such as the aforementioned springbox. And I don't actually subscribe to that point of view anyway, I was merely suggesting that if a DM wanted to rule that way, I could understand it.
Dieter Zimmerman
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walrusjester
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Post by walrusjester » Sun Dec 16, 2007 5:58 pm

mythfish wrote:
In any case, I don't think it would be unreasonable to require a coglayer to build two Gargantuan springboxes to affect a Colossal mech. Or extrapolate from table 2-2 on page 72 and figure that if a Large mech is 10 ft high, a steam power built for a Large mech can affect 10 ft worth of mech. So for a Colossal mech at 35 ft, you would need 3.5 Large spring boxes (or I suppose a Large springbox and a Gargantuan springbox).
That's exactly right. It lets mechs have steam powers but requires a decent number of coglayers to make it work for larger mechs. A GM is always within their rights to make decisions about their games, but as The General Rule, use what Mythfish said.
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